Energy From Thorium Discussion Forum

It is currently Sep 23, 2018 12:42 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 21 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Salt Analysis Tool
PostPosted: Sep 01, 2014 7:48 pm 
Offline

Joined: Jan 16, 2012 7:15 am
Posts: 94
Another video, on the data and database I've been developing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4YU7D4f ... tu.be&hd=1

I wanted to call it "Episode 2: The Phantom Menace", but that's been taken.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Salt Analysis Tool
PostPosted: Nov 16, 2014 3:34 pm 
Offline

Joined: Jan 16, 2012 7:15 am
Posts: 94
Well, it was a lot more work than I thought, but here is the data I intend to use for my simulation of salt evolution. I think comma delimited text files are the most flexible, so these are .csv files. Elements is the only one in it original database form. The other base tables, View_Isotopes, View_Branches, and View_Init_Yield, have a Protons column that came from a View (SQL query). The protons field doesn't belong in these tables, but it is needed for QC or analysis in Excel. FuelSets_Yield is a derivative table that omits the high-speed neutron data and has complete decay chains (which Init_Yield lacks).
In addition to the Access tables, there is a "composite" file named ViewFull. This one is best for data mining in Excel. I'm in the middle of of a new video that covers the basics of what I call data mining.

I made a YouTube video to document the data development process. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgU7_XgEtPk&feature=youtu.be&hd=1


Attachments:
View_Branches.csv [43.82 KiB]
Downloaded 153 times
FuelSets_Yield.csv [1.31 MiB]
Downloaded 147 times
Elements.csv [1.85 KiB]
Downloaded 142 times
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Salt Analysis Tool
PostPosted: Nov 16, 2014 3:37 pm 
Offline

Joined: Jan 16, 2012 7:15 am
Posts: 94
Oops. Looks like I am limited to three attachments. Here are the rest:


Attachments:
ViewFull.csv [2.33 MiB]
Downloaded 181 times
View_Isotopes.csv [153.83 KiB]
Downloaded 169 times
View_Init_Yield.csv [1.71 MiB]
Downloaded 149 times
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Salt Analysis Tool
PostPosted: Mar 02, 2015 1:29 pm 
Offline

Joined: Jan 21, 2008 9:12 pm
Posts: 317
Location: idaho falls
to both Steve & Holger

I've recently started a topic about Kasten's MOSEL two fluid Th breeder reactor concept in the "fluoride reactor design" section & have also posted a draft of a paper I've put together which points out why people should consider reviving it.

I haven't the faintest idea how to go about determining how much FP could accumulate before it'd die, A better way to say this is that I don't know what fraction of its fuel salt must be "reprocessed" every day at steady state - which is a really important datum because it determines how practical/affordable it'd be.

It sounds to me that you guys could probably do that. True?
.
Let's discuss this.

_________________
Darryl Siemer


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Salt Analysis Tool
PostPosted: Mar 03, 2015 7:16 pm 
Offline

Joined: Jan 16, 2012 7:15 am
Posts: 94
Daryl,
My simulation is intended to analyze fission products (and eventually failed-fuel) for generic reactors. The goal is to analyze entire fleets of reactors, so the simulation is not very detailed. The user specifies a reactor design with just two numbers, fast and slow “contribution”. A thermal reactor might have 8% contribution from fast neutrons. Slow neutrons cause 92% of the fissions in that reactor. (I don't know the range of fast/slow values for a fast reactor, much less your epi-thermal.) The user also specifies the fuel or fuel mix. Currently, that will not change over the lifetime of the reactor/salt, because I don't have a method for evolving the actinides/failed-fuel.

The lifetime of the reactor/salt is flexible. I will publish a table of fission products (FP), with snapshots of the FP inventory at ten days, 3 weeks, 6 weeks, 3 months, six months, 1, 2, 4, 8, 16, and 32 years. The user can put those together to “age” the salt for up to 64 years minus ten days.

The ten day minimum time step allows me to assume that all isotopes with half lives less than a day have reached equilibrium. (Another way of looking at it is that each snapshot is taken after ten days of cooling.) The published table will only have isotopes with half lives longer than a day. That leaves out 135-Xe, but I think you are more worried about the rare earths. I could give you growth curves for those. However, I won't know at what point their neutron eating tendencies become an operational problem. This is most emphatically NOT a neutron counting model. All I can give you is the populations of isotopes at various times, given a reactor design (fast% + slow% = 100) and the static fuel(s) of your choice.

Note also that the table will have absolutely no salt cleaning assumptions. The idea is to provide data from which salt cleaning decisions can be made. It also has no FP absorption, so, for instance, 149-Sm keeps on growing, rather than leveling off after 500 hours or so (Wikipedia: Neutron Poison).

I expect to have the FP population-over-time table ready soon (and fusion is just twenty years away). I'll need some help on the FP neutron absorption and failed-fuel evolution. Help me with this and you can own that excellent conversation starter, “I'm building a nuclear reactor in my basement!”


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Salt Analysis Tool
PostPosted: Mar 04, 2015 4:32 pm 
Offline

Joined: Jan 21, 2008 9:12 pm
Posts: 317
Location: idaho falls
SteveMoniz wrote:
Daryl,
... I will publish a table of fission products (FP), with snapshots of the FP inventory at ten days, 3 weeks, 6 weeks, 3 months, six months, 1, 2, 4, 8, 16, and 32 years. The user can put those together to “age” the salt for up to 64 years minus ten days.

...

I expect to have the FP population-over-time table ready soon (and fusion is just twenty years away). I'll need some help on the FP neutron absorption and failed-fuel evolution. Help me with this and you can own that excellent conversation starter, “I'm building a nuclear reactor in my basement!”


I look forward to seeing these.

_________________
Darryl Siemer


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 21 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group