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 Post subject: Modelling Materials
PostPosted: Mar 14, 2014 4:02 am 
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Joined: Oct 27, 2013 6:54 pm
Posts: 2
Hi all,

Would this be worth doing...

As I understand it all the materials to be used in a LFTR aren't concrete (pun intended). Hastelloy-N is regarded as the main candidate for a lot of the exposed infrastructure, (Right so far?). So with a big materials R&D gap would it be possible to provide specialized training instructions to the LFTR supporters describing how to model and test different materials against the environmental factors the material would be subjected to i.e. radiation, high temps, salt induced corrosion?

Alternatively, if the learning curve is too steep and there are LFTR supporters out there with modelling experience, could the rest of us choose to supply some of our computing power to calculations that may require a lot of processing power? Similar to what SETI used to do I think?

Just an idea I had, computer modelling isn't my background so was wondering how feasible the above would be or if it is totally bonkers.

Cheers


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 Post subject: Re: Modelling Materials
PostPosted: Apr 02, 2014 5:21 pm 
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Joined: Oct 27, 2013 6:54 pm
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So that's a no...?


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 Post subject: Re: Modelling Materials
PostPosted: Apr 03, 2014 3:31 am 
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Joined: Mar 14, 2014 1:19 pm
Posts: 28
Location: Switzerland
Modelling materials (for which environment?) is quite hard because most of the time you can not derive the behavior from first principles. It needs experimental validation anyway, so, you would better stick to experiments, which are unfortunately quite expensive.


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 Post subject: Re: Modelling Materials
PostPosted: Apr 29, 2014 4:39 pm 
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Joined: Sep 22, 2013 2:27 pm
Posts: 262
Hi Boris, modelling materials ...if a realistic modelling is feasible...could reduce testing costs by a preselection of the most promising materials.

Holger


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 Post subject: Re: Modelling Materials
PostPosted: May 03, 2014 11:32 pm 
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Joined: Apr 07, 2014 8:02 am
Posts: 1
Location: Sugar Land, Texas
The material used in the MSBR was Hastelloy-N. Experiments conducted with "salt loops" indicated that LiF and BeF2 corroded the tubing only a fraction of a tenth of a millimeter in five years of testing. Principally, Chromium was leached out of the metal matrix. Perhaps the Chromium weight percent could be reduced, or replaced with a different metalic element to form a new alloy. I'm trying to get a local nuclear engineering department to help do some research in this area. I will post results as they become available.

The Chinese have indicated that they have developed new Hastelloy versions, and this should be a research topic we should address. New materials proposals should be based on existing metallurgy showing promising alloys to use in corrosion experiments.

Successful LFTR design will involve commitment to studying inorganic and nuclear chemistry; LFTR is a chemist's reactor, from the liquid fissile core, to the fertile blanket, to the chemical processing of the salts carrier, to the Xenon gas processing -- it's all about chemistry.

This is one reason why the NRC is hesitant to license it -- they know little about it compared to LWR designs, & have no commercial reactor experience or history to be able to formulate safety regulations. They know a lot about commercial reactor design today -- which all about solid fuels, but the LFTR is the "unknown" - it's scary!


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 Post subject: Re: Modelling Materials
PostPosted: May 29, 2014 2:38 am 
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Joined: Sep 22, 2013 2:27 pm
Posts: 262
Hi Larry,

yes I agree it is a lot of chemistry in the MSR concepts making the concept.

As soon as the reactor is going to become realized it is engineering. If I have a look on the different Gen. IV initiatives they are mainly driven by physicist and lack the engineering.

Holger


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